I have a syncing issue between a program I’m running on my Atari ST, and my other midi sequencers. The program I’m running is called “M” and can not be slaved to external clocks, it can only send the clock signal to another sequencer. Everything works as it should, except for one (annoying) detail.
Each time I switch to a new “snapshot” (basically a new sequence) in “M” while it’s running, it sends a stop signal, quickly followed by a start signal. It does this to ensure sync with the external gear, which works. Ignoring these start/stop messages actually causes the slaved external sequencer to go out of sync, so it’s necessary to sync up again this way every time a pattern is switched, and I don’t mind so much.
My problem is mainly that the moment stop/start is sent to let’s say, a slaved drum machine with kick drums on every beat, I’m hearing two kick drums with some 20 ms delay in between, (this delay amount could differ each time) at the first beat of the pattern. The first kick is the kick drum that would sound without the start/stop message, the second is the one caused by the automatic start message roughly 20 ms later, which doesn’t sound great.
So my question is, would there be a clever way to use the Bomebox to sync up the slaved drum machine by slowing it down by the correct amount, and not needing the stop/start message? Or maybe by muting the first sound in the pattern on the slaved drum machine, which would otherwise be triggered by the start message? Or another way I didn’t consider yet? I’m testing this now using a slaved Octatrack, but I have the same problem when using other drum machines.
I think the best way to approach this is to look at the log of incoming messages in MT Pro. Then maybe we can get it to suppress one of the kick messages if the incoming MIDI is predicable. Once done with MT Pro, then the project file would be uploaded to BomeBox for execution there. It seems that if a stop message is sent, then any extraneous notes (kicks) are sent after the stop message and before the next start message, they should be suppressed.
Steve Caldwell
Bome Customer Care
Also available for paid consulting services: bome@sniz.biz
Great thanks! I’ll connect it to MTP and copy the log to here. I also thought that another maybe simpler solution could be to just mute any note that is repeated within a certain amount of time, like 20 ms, on the drum midi channel (ch 10 in my case). I think it could be done using the timer? I guess the timer would have to be triggered with every note, and whenever same note appears while the timer is still running it would be muted. I think I could figure this out, though I’m not sure if this could be done using only one timer?
I’ve recorded the clock and start/stop messages coming from the Atari ST into MTP via my Zoom audio interface. What’s happening in the log is: I’m starting the sequencer, it runs for one measure after which I switch to another pattern, which also plays for one measure, and then I hit stop.
The start/stop message is visible in the middle, this is where the pattern is switched.
Well it is a bit difficult to tell how to manipulate because I don’t see resulting notes from your timing clock. Maybe you can also capture that in a log?
With that said, the attached project may help.
What we do is look at Start and Continue messages as well as timing clock messages
After a Start or continue, we suppress timing clock from going through a counter.
Translator 1.0 and 1.1 set the counter (ga) to the global variable (gb) which is defined in translator 0.2 rules.
Translate 1.2 will decrement ga and once it reaches 0 will allow timing clock to pass but will otherwise suppress the translator for passing through timing clock
Translator 1.3 has an outgoing action of none and is necessary since I have set up a pass thru route for all other MIDI messages in the MIDI router. Swallow only works if the translator executes or if the outgoing action is none. Since the rules of 1.2 exit when the counter is not 0, the translator will not execute so the message will not be swallowed. Translator 1.3 takes care of this for us.
So to modify the number of clocks you want to suppress, simply modify the global variable gb in the rules of translator 0.2. Right now I set it for 12 which should be a single quarter note.
I’m thinking your device will not play notes (kick), with the suppressed timing clocks.
Oh and if you want the Start and Continue messages to pass through, then you will need to modify the outgoing actions of translator 1.0 and 1.2 accordingly (to the same incoming trigger)
Steve Caldwell
Bome Customer Care
Also available for paid consulting services: bome@sniz.biz
Ah great thanks! I will do some additional testing with this to see if it works!
I also captured another log, which has the kick drum notes this time.
It seems that the stop messages mute the previous kick drum, and the start message triggers the second kick very close to this event. I’d have to somehow also suppress this stop message, or just the note off message that is sent because of it. There is one timing clock message before the next kick drum, but I have a feeling it might be triggered because of the start message that comes after that timing clock, and just before the note is triggered, as start resets the slaved Octatrack to 0 so it plays the first midi note (kick drum) in the pattern.
So it looks like the first kick is coming just before the stop command so maybe the best thing to do is to suppress the first kick after a start or continue command. instead of counting MIDI syncs. The first kick after the the start command comes only after 1 sync so you could certainly still use the original strategy and figure out when you want your first kick. The 12 count I provided will make it a little under 1 quarter note. I guess you will just have to play with it until you get it sounding right for you.
Steve Caldwell
Bome Customer Care
Also available for paid consulting services: bome@sniz.biz
After some experimenting I have it working perfectly! I changed the translator so that upon receiving a stop message, a timer set to “multiple times” is activated with a repeat count of 5, set as global variable (gb), and a repeat delay of 1 ms. I’m also using a global variable for the counted number (ga) which is ga = 0 when the stop message is received.
In the second translator I’m receiving the timer and I’ve added these rules:
ga=ga+1
if ga==gb then ga=0
so ga counts in my case until 5 and then resets back to 0
Then I’m using another translator to pass through midi notes from the other sequencer, one for midi on and one for midi off both with these rules:
if ga>0 then exit rules, skip Outgoing Action
So all midi notes will be suppressed during those 5 ms after the stop message.
So far this seems to work! Those 5 ms seem to be exactly the amount of time needed to make these transitions smooth. The MTP project you supplied me with helped a lot, and I think I understand the timer and global variables a little better! Thanks a lot!
As much as I like helping users with solutions, I like it even better when I can show the concepts and then the user takes the initiative to apply the concepts and modify them to meet their individual needs. There is often more than one way to solve a problem and it looks like you have found the best way for you and your situation.
Regards,
Steve Caldwell
Bome Customer Care
Also available for paid consulting services: bome@sniz.biz